The Marketing Futurist Podcast

Mind-blowing inspiration to create and innovate

This is your futurist advantage!


With your hosts:

Mary Kathryn Johnson & Kelly Garrett

Ep013: Bob Jenkins of LeadPages and Drip Talks Action Now and Revision Later

Show Transcript:

00:01 – Welcome back, marketing futurists. I’m Kelly Garrett and you know Mary Kathryn Johnson and today I am so excited to have a very special guest with us, Bob Jenkins from lead pages and drip. Hey Bob, how are you?

00:16 – I’m doing great Kelly. Thanks so much for having me. As part of this feature is summit and Mary Kathryn. Great to see you as well.

00:22 – Yes, so we’re so excited. Lead pages and drip are two of my absolute favorite marketing tools to use and both companies are one company. You guys are all so innovative. I just am so excited to hear what you have to say and what types of things you can bring to everybody. Absolutely. So why don’t you tell us just a little bit of your history, kind of what you’ve been up to and how you found your way to lead pages.

00:54 – So I’ve been a high school teacher for 10 years right out of college and during that timeframe I had discovered that education was a passion but not a profession in the public school setting. So around ninth or 10th year I started to explore my own business and after that, transition into entrepreneurship, I discovered I was really good at answering people’s questions and teaching them how to use technology tools to further their own businesses. So for a decade after my decade of teaching, I had my own business as the Bob, the teacher brand that expanded into business coaching, but mostly teaching tech tools. And one of my tools that I started to utilize back in 2013 was lead pages. I was one of the very first customers. I’m actually one of the first 200, I’m customer number 43 of around $50,000 at this point and loved using it, love teaching other entrepreneurs how to use it.

01:48 – And eventually the co founder and then CEO, Clay Collins came knocking and said, hey, why don’t you make some videos for us? And Mary Kathryn, you were mentioning earlier that you got to see some of those tutorials as you started to learn lead pages. And then eventually became a full time gig. So since 2014, right after I got married to my wife Theresa, I started working for lead pages and I’ve been there ever since and my role here is to present webinars and podcasts and to basically teach marketing strategies and how lead pages and drip can fit in to the technology stack to make that a really easy.

02:27 – Nice. So that seems like it was a very seamless transition into everything. Those are Kinda the, the best time, the best ones I think. Yeah.

02:36 – Yeah. I mean it wasn’t overnight of course, but it was a good decision and continued to be a, continues to be a great one.

02:44 – Right. So what major obstacles have you encountered over your time at lead pages and seeing things change?

02:52 – Yeah. So that’s a great question. I think as an entrepreneur to. I’ve seen quite a few obstacles along the way. It tends to be trying to be a very authentic and transparent person and figure in a world of hype. So in my role as a, as an educator beforehand, when I was doing speeches and giving talks at marketing conferences and still to this day here at lead pages, we run into people who are, there’s two problems there, either apathetic or don’t want to move forward in a way that really takes what their goals are and wants them to take them into action or they’re susceptible to hype. And two promises of get rich quick types of things. And so the obstacles that I continue to face being reasonable and logical about saying, these are the things you have to do.

03:46 – These are some things that require some effort and some work and we’re running up against the noise of you can just do this with pushing a button and everything just comes magically to you. And unfortunately, that’s really easy to buy into. And then months down the road or even a year down the road, we have people come to us and say, man, I just was. I just wish I would’ve listened to you the first time because I wasted all this time and all this effort. And especially a lot of money, you know, throwing away at these, you know, fantasy things eventually is what they came to realize. So that’s, that’s really the biggest obstacle is trying to be authentic and tell the truth about what it takes to be successful in business when there’s all this noise of easy buttons that just don’t exist. Um, that’s, that’s really the biggest obstacle that I see facing, you know, businesses like ours right now.

04:37 – Absolutely. That is one of my biggest pet peeves too, is, is just this false impression that it’s so easy to get one. I understand why people get that impression because, you know, we want to make things easier for people. But like you say, that doesn’t mean it’s an easy button. It’s just one, one thing you have to do to magically have success. So yeah, I think that balance of teaching people and helping them understand how much work and effort you do have to put towards things to make it successful versus trying to make tools easier to use and do a better job right from the box. That’s kind of a conflict a little bit. Yeah, and you know, can I say really quickly, there’s people always get confused with the two words. Simple and easy, right? I mean marketing is pretty simple. You communicate with customers, you build relationships with customers. If they like what you’ve got, they buy it. It’s not easy. It’s not easy. It’s difficult to do a lot of the things that we do.

05:42 – Right? I mean it’s very rare that someone can be successful in. The danger is, is that people that do give off that impression in ads or facebook or from stage is that they’re an overnight and the overnight success comes from 10 years of back foundational work, whether they were in business that long or they were getting experiences that made it possible for where they are today and you know, there’s nothing better than relationships in time and experience and feedback loops to get people to where they want to go and that does require some patients and unfortunately that can be something that people don’t really want to want to admit to needing at the time. Right, absolutely. That’s spot on. So, so what do you think is a good tip for people to overcome? You know, that, that fallacy that they see?

06:35 – Yeah, I think, I think part of it is just to admit that there isn’t an easy path that doesn’t require some effort. And that doesn’t mean again, just like Mary Kathryn just said, it’s not like things have to be hard. You know, it’s not like you have to struggle, but there is time and energy that you put into things. So it’s number one is waking up to that reality and number two, it’s trying to do a little self reflection and look at your inbox, look at your receipts that you’ve invested in programs that promised the moon and the stars software tools that said that this would happen within 30 days or less. And think about, you know, is this something that you bought into because it is the path that everybody else is doing and they’re getting something that you’re not. And if you really are honest with yourself, if I’m honest with myself, when I went through the same kind of thought process when I first stopped teaching and went into my own business, I could say the same kind of thing.

07:32 – It’s like I’m in a real hurry to generate revenue and I think every business owner wants to generate more revenue in the next week or the next month as much as possible. And that’s, that’s amazing. You know, that there’s no problem with that. But the challenge to overcome is just to think, did that work for me in the past and isn’t going to work? Or can I lay out some goals, some benchmark goals of what to achieve. So for example, one thing I’d recommend people that are relatively newer to business, maybe you’ve been in for a year or two and you haven’t quite cracked that replaced my full time income that I used to have. And you know, you’re still trying to get that to go is to number one thing to is yourself. What else am I missing? And is the next thing that I’m being asked to buy or invest in or tools that I’m looking at isn’t going to get me closer to my goals or is it going to distract me?

08:24 – Does it require a lot of other things? Right. And then if you’re more in business, you know, have more experience. You’ve been doing this for five, 10 years and you found yourself at a plateau and you’re, you’re hearing the same kind of thing to think to yourself, you know, am I really going towards the type of customer, the type of products and service that I’m offering that really hones in on my strengths and my core values? Or am I looking at just doing things because it’s a hot thing. You know, right now the biggest craze online right now is cryptocurrency and bitcoin and ethereum and all these other cool things and they’re amazing and there’s going to be a such noise or the next 12 months about that, that it’s going to be really easy for someone who’s struggling or who’s at a plateau in their business to think, oh, I’m just going to put that on hold.

09:09 – I’m going to go over here into a wild west of things that I don’t quite understand, but that’s where the money’s going to be made. And I’d tell you there is not. It’s kind of funny at this. There’s not a, it’s, it’s not something that’s, you know, you can play with lightly and that is the same for anything else that you’re looking at. New tools come along all the time. New themes come along, new plugins come along, new autoresponder email services, landing page builders. They all come along and you have to just think of yourself as it’s going to get me closer to my goal, and faster. Or is it going to be a distraction? And I think for most people, they’re really honest with themselves, changing horses midstream is really going to be dangerous for them. So it’s really about awareness. It’s really about asking the reflective questions and then sticking to what is my clear goal that I’m trying to accomplish this quarter and this year and let’s stick to that. You know, because there are people on the other side of your business who are really hungry for your solution and every time you change direction or change tech stacks or change tool sets or whatever, you’re going to delay your solution getting in their hands. And I think that’s really unfortunate that that continues to happen for a lot of people.

10:18 – Oh yeah. I love it. I love it. You know, you change horses midstream. I just had this vision of your inner horse race and you’re trying to get on another horse and guess what? You try and do that in the middle of the race and you’re going to fall off and you’re going to get a good chance. The horses going on a different track and you’re just like overlapping this three d chess sort of race track, but it looks like, Oh look, the shiny horse and so you can you try and jump? Yeah, and another thing that you probably would agree, I may ask you this if you agree, but sometimes we do have to evaluate some of the new tools that are coming because that’s what happens. These. There are new tools and new techniques that we can use and we do have to evaluate them, but I agree with you.

10:59 – If you look at what you’re evaluating in this new shiny thing and this amazing new opportunity and you say, all right, is this going to help me now and actually let me move forward now in my business and in fact my business right now? Or is this just something that might be interesting sometime down the road but doesn’t really impact me right now? And if it impacts me right now and it can help me right now, then yeah, go for it. Check it out, see if it really is. But if it’s just something that’s kind of fun that you want to look at, like crypto currency, are you a banker or are you making money by, by you know, buying and selling on the stock market. Is that your business? Well then you might want to look at it, but if it’s not focus dude, right?

11:43 – Yeah. Yeah, exactly. And I think you raised a really great points here, Mary Kathryn, and I think that it’s worth exploring a bit more. I work with lead pages and so some people watching this, perhaps you’re watching this right now, you’re not a user of drip or lead pages and you’re going to hear me say, Hey, you should perhaps give either one of those a try. Right? And you might say, well that’s not. You just said don’t change horses. The question is, are the tools you’re using getting you to your goals? And if they’re not, then it does make sense to take a look at new technologies and perhaps it takes a couple of days to learn or a couple of hours or a couple days to learn something new. But man, there’s so many cool things that you know, whether it’s one of our pieces of software or something else where it does help you get accomplished.

12:28 – It does help you accomplish a goal faster. Does it help you take tasks as just like hiring an employee? Now you know if you are at a point in your business where you’re thinking, I need somebody to do this, well, hiring an employee is a perfect example of one of those things. It’s going to take some time away from your daily thing in order to find the right person to put the right ad on the right job site and then get the right interviews to be done and all that stuff, but it’s so worth it at the end because you’ve set a goal, you know what your objective is, and then you take the time to actually put that into action. The same thing will be true with any technology tool that you use, like drip really page. Is there anything else where you’re going to say, I need to reflect on what my goals are? I’m going to run and I think this might be a solution that could help you out. Then it’s a function of exploring that, talking to people that have experience and saying, Yep, that’s for me or no, it’s not. And then again, pursuing your goals.

13:23 – Absolutely. So yeah. So at the end of the day, tools or just tools and unless you have the rights, a strategy behind the tools. Yeah, there’s, there’s no point in jumping ship and using them, but what can we expect from tools like drip and lead pages as the future of marketing evolves? What kinds of things do you see that are going to be most important as technology advances?

13:51 – Yeah. Well for us, I can tell you that one of the most important things for us is the speed of deployment. So being able to go into a lead pages account or a drip account and hit a couple buttons and having a campaign ready to go, that’s going to be much faster. We have this idea of shareable things as a major focus going through the rest of this year and into next year where you have things like shareable templates, you have shareable campaigns, you have shareable workflows over in drip and not only are we building those output, our users are building those out as well and being able to share them with people that they have as customers or clients or just colleagues that they’re working with. So any software tool that you’re having, you’re, you’re seeing in a lot of places in the world, you know, leading edge software tools where there are blueprints or playbooks or you know, drift causing playbooks, drip caused them sharable workflows, a lead pages, shareable templates and some other cool stuff coming out later in the year.

14:53 – And all of it’s a function of, of allowing you to have a starting point that’s further than zero. Right? What I don’t want people to get the impression of, and I think this is where people again fall victim to a little bit of susceptibility, is having a button that then everything is done. You know, that takes all the creativity and entrepreneurship out of the equation and it doesn’t work. You know, if you could push a button and everything’s done and you have hands off, well a thousand people in your little business area or bigger business area of millions of people could have the same thing and then it sort of loses its edge. Right? But what we want to avoid is having this long timeframe for deployment. So if we can take the bones of it, give it to you in a faster way, and then let you use your brain and intellect to actually turn it into something that’s effective and impactful for people. Boy, isn’t that a great win, win solution and that’s where the future for drip and lead pages is. And I think for most software companies particularly that know what’s coming, you know, we can talk about personalization as well, but it’s about speed of deployment and doing so in such a way that you take a lot of the guests workout from the start.

16:10 – Wow. Okay. So Kelly and I are both techie doubts and you love playing around with technology. And so what you’re saying just like lights me up, but we also have clients and some of our clients understand things faster, some understand things slower. So when you look at trying to find that sweet spot is what I hear you saying right, between a template and having as much done for you as possible, but yet allowing for the customization and uniqueness and flair and creativity and all that stuff. How in the world do you find that sweet spot? And I have a second part once you’ve. Once you’ve done that one, because even more importantly from there, there’s another thing that we have to think about, but how do you find that sweet spot?

16:54 – Yeah. Well it’s a dance, you know, it’s kind of like a, some people would call it a pendulum, I’d call it more of a spiral towards a target. I’m my own business motto is take action, revise later. And that is very similar to what you’re talking about here where we shoot for the best and then we continue to get the feedback loop to tell us how accurate that that particular, aim was. So that’s one thing. And second thing is that we’re at an age where, again, this is, this is more of a pendulum swing where we have people that think that they have to do everything themselves and on the other end we have people that don’t want to touch anything and they want somebody else to do it for them, but then they don’t know who to trust because they don’t know enough to ask the right questions to get to the right person to do the stuff for them.

17:40 – So the sweet spot for us, your lead pages and drip is to try to give people the overall strategy and the ability to do it themselves while also training certification students to have a trusted directory of people who can then carry forward that strategy and implement it for them. So I think you’ve. You’ll find that more and more business owners are going to have the acumen to go in and get their hands dirty and do it when they need to. But with the time value proposition for themselves, they know that they are better served to not do that on a daily basis. But they know enough to ask the right questions and then hire the right people on a freelance basis or fulltime basis to actually execute. So one of the things I’m really excited about at lead pages and drip is for the last year we’ve been training certification students.

18:26 – So now we have dozens of people who invested a lot of time and money to become qualified for us to be able to then send them, send people to them. So I think most software tools and businesses that are doing similar things as ours are going to have that kind of repository of people because otherwise you’re going on random websites and and hiring a virtual assistant and assuming that they know more about things and you do. And for a lot of them you know they’re really good at what they do, but they might not know anything about the tool stack that you’re using. Which brings me to a side tangent and that is when you hire a virtual assistant or someone full time, if they don’t already know the tools that you are using, they may persuade you to use a different tool set. Because that’s what they’re familiar with and then it’s really dangerous because you know, you’re a team members are going to come and go and it might be the case that their recommendation is really solid for your business, but it’s more important for you to hire someone if you’re going to do that, uh, you’re going to hire someone who already does have the skillset of the tools that you’ve invested in and it’s, you know, well, because the end of the day people take vacations, stuff happens in their families.

19:33 – And as a business owner, you’re ultimately responsible for things getting done. So, I want to make sure that you know enough to get your hands dirty, but you also know how to get the right people on your team.

19:44 – That’s definitely. I see both ends of the spectrum with clients is terms of the ones that want to do it all themselves and they don’t ever want to hand it off. And then the others that want to not touch it at all. And it’s really important to make sure that you have a handle on what’s going on and how things are operating. Because at the end of the day, you’re the one in charge of making the decisions and driving the lead, you know, the direction that the company is going to go. So if you can’t make those decisions with a little bit of knowledge of how things are working in the technical systems, it’s, it’s not a very good place to be for sure. No, and let me follow up that now because you’re talking about that we’ve been talking to people like yourself who are there beyond cutting edge.

20:31 – I mean, we’re beyond bleeding edge. I mean, you guys are creating the future for us and we are helping you create that by participating in these processes that you are outlining and we are Kelly and I know are so incredibly grateful to be able to do that and excited. So. But we also know that because we are part of these, uh, the future of these programs were using these programs in the wild west. Daily. They break, they do things that all of a sudden we think they’re going to do something and, and the ideas are great and the processes are great, but they break sometimes and sometimes don’t work. Or when there’s a release of a new, a new function, others break. So what are, I’ve just answered my own question in that sense, but I’d like you to speak to what we know, what the pitfalls are because we are in the future right now, but what, how do we handle those things? How can we navigate that as successfully as possible?

21:31 – Well, I’ll tell you the one thing I wouldn’t want you to do a which we see often is immediately jump on twitter or facebook to public forums and say, why is this thing not working? Anybody else seeing that this doesn’t work. That doesn’t help anybody, right? Because it just doesn’t. So number one thing is to reach out to the support team of whatever software tool that you’re working with and say, Hey, I’ve got this issue. So a little bit of patience and forgiveness goes a long way when you’re dealing with technical tools. And I think everybody that you are talking to during this, during this summit has the same kind of situation where they’re just what you’re speaking to. They release a new feature. Something happens. And Oh, no, this is the worst thing ever. I got to switch programs because there’s this bug or something.

22:19 – I don’t, I don’t get it. You know, I really, I don’t get it. There are certain situations where it’s like, yeah, you were let down and that makes total sense. So one thing is forgiveness and another thing is, asking for support from the right people. Because when you go onto social forums, it’s a noisy responses you’re going to get from people that may not know anything about what you’re talking about. And I can tell you from experience, I’m in a lot of different forums. And one of the, the chief responses of someone saying, Hey, I’m having this problem is there’s a bunch of people that say you should switch to some other program. And again, when you’re, when you’re in the middle of a problem, that’s just a cute little thing. And then you start to hear all this noise, it’s very distracting and yeah, it could be the case of the software tool that you’re using, you know, just isn’t being as supportive as well or whatever the case may be.

23:11 – But, I can tell you from my own experience as an entrepreneur and then seeing this in the different farms I’m in is, it’s, it’s a lot more noise usually then help. Okay. So when things do break a asked for help from the right people and try to be persistent about that. The next thing I would say, the response to that, Mary Kathryn, is to make sure that, again, you’re clear on what your goals are for your business and for your company and if you’re trying to do something that isn’t, you know, you’re trying to just use your imagination on what to accomplish with a particular tool. Recognize, you know, it may be the case is not built yet, so go to that same software company, same tool set and say, look, I’m looking for this feature, I don’t even know if it exists anywhere, let alone in your product.

23:55 – But, you know, let’s talk any software company that’s in the future market, which is just talking about it for us and like many chat and all these other cool companies you have in this, in this setup for the summit, they’re always thinking what’s the next feature? And we have a list of like 80 things, 800 things probably have what we want to do and we can’t get them all done at once. So it’s requests and feedback loops that tell us what should the priorities be a. and then we get to roll those out. So for example, actually I want, I want to spill the beans yet. I’ll see what other questions you may have first. But I do, I do want to share something cool that we just launched it lead pages, that, you know, I think would help answer some of these questions, but I’ll, I’ll stop for that.

24:45 – We’re hanging out. Okay, cool.

24:49 – So, so one of the things that I want everybody who’s thinking about the future of marketing to consider is in your own business, what are, what are problems that people are facing that everybody just assumes that’s just the status quo, that’s just the way things should be, and they’re not really willing to necessarily think that there could be a better way. Right? So for us, one of those things is always traffic. You know, when it comes to building an email list when it comes to getting people to landing pages or websites with optin opportunities on them, traffic is a really big deal. And so one of the things that people often talk about, it’s like, well, you should use facebook and facebook is just recently reported. Two Point, oh, 3 billion monthly users around the planet. Uh, you know, it’s a huge marketplace. There’s a lot of stuff in there.

25:43 – And the idea of running a campaign is pretty intimidating, pretty overwhelming. And so the status quo is, well, you just gotta learn how to go into facebook, go into the ads manager, figure it out, figure out what your pixel should go, what the hell is a pixel in the first place, you know, and what do I do for an ad and blah, blah, blah. And so we’ve recently been having conversations with facebook and just this past week we’ve released a new feature within lead pages in partnership with facebook that’s an ad builder within lead pages. So when you go to publish your, your landing page, you can hit a button and it opens up a modal to run an ad with just a couple of clicks. And in less than about 45 seconds without ever going to facebook, you have your own ad running to promote your landing page, choosing your audience.

26:38 – The Pixel is inserted automatically into the right spots on your pages, so you’d never have to see what that is. And it’s tracking your conversions as well. It also pulls up an ad. It makes the ad image and the copy for you based on the content of your page. And the connection to your business page, you can edit that, of course you can modify everything, but you can do everything within the lead pages window and never have to go into the ads manager. Now Savvy, savvier users will also go into the ads manager and do more advanced things once they get up and running. But for the newer user of facebook ads, this is a great way for them to not have to think too hard to simplify it. Push a couple buttons. And again, it’s the starting point is done. That’s the deployment that I mentioned earlier as much faster. And that’s our goal with this, with this new feature is to be able to deploy an ad and get traffic to a new brand new landing page within minutes of hitting publish in the first place. That’s the goal. And we’re really excited about launching this and seeing the early results from people using it just for the last few days.

27:43 – Great. Can’t wait to use it myself, but yeah. Oh my gosh. You know, I just, that’s so for someone like me because I handle the stuff, once we get the subscriber, once we get the person, once we get the audience and I hire someone to do that facebook stuff because yeah, it’s a nightmare headache for me to even think about. Yeah. So to be able to do that from a, from my actual landing page or my lead page that I just created as part of this whole campaign is just, it’s, it’s going to be a sigh of relief, you know, which is, which is as an entrepreneur all I want out of my day. Right? How many cases I’ve got to keep track of. Right. But you know, I gotta ask you something really quickly and I’m really glad that you’ve obviously been partnering with facebook on this because I’ve also heard that facebook prefers for the landing page to be the actual url, or the, the actual, you know, website that you’re using to promote. So how are you handling that from the lead pages as you know, a separate page. And I haven’t gone into wordpress and, you know, put a wonderful, beautiful lincoln there and brought in my lead pages into my wordpress site and blah, blah blah. How do you handle that?

29:01 – Yeah. So for, in this particular case, we are publishing these to the lead pages server or to the customer domain that you might’ve set up. So a feature of lead pages is you have pages dot Mary Kathryn Dot Com or whatever your, your name, your website may be. And any page published to those or to the leadpages server is able to utilize this publishing feature at the current time as we’re doing this training, you’re not able to do that through the wordpress plugin. We can control, we can control and we can’t insearch and control what the pages through your wordpress plugin and just takes a manual effort to do that. So we’re not able to do it automatically. So that being said, you know, a lot of people don’t take that extra time to go through the wordpress publishing in the first place. Once you set up a custom domain one time, then you can publish to that.

29:54 – You know, forever. So that’s a, that’s a really good advantage. I’d also love to make sure to mention that over on the drip side, in tandem with this, we’re able to take people who are in a certain stage of your marketing funnel, a in we call these workflows, right? As soon as they hit a certain point in that workflow, they’re able to be added to a custom audience that you can then advertise your landing page too. And they can be removed after they’ve had a certain point, right? So if you have, for example, an ad campaign and you’re trying to get people to join a Webinar, for example, they go into a workflow inside of drip and when they hit that point, you can hit remove them from advertise my webinar. Now they’re in a new audience. You add them to an audience that says, show up to my webinar and you can start running your ad to that.

30:43 – And then after the Webinar’s over, you can send traffic to a new audience of people who should see the offer who haven’t purchased yet. So in your workflow, there’s a spot that you’d have, did they buy or not, and if not advertised, put them in the audience that says go buy the thing you heard about on the Webinar and on the learning page gets to connect the dots there too. So you have this opportunity to never have to go in the ads manager if you don’t want to. Although again, Savvier folks, we’ll do both, but just getting started and being able to add and remove people to audiences within drip and lead pages is extremely powerful for those that are a little bit more intimidated by that and they’ve been spending a lot of money with third parties. You know, there are great agencies, are great people who run campaigns for people, but isn’t it great to know that you can do this yourself and when you want to outsource it to someone else that you know what they’re talking about, you know how to do it and you know what it takes and now you just are more informed and empowered entrepreneur.

31:40 – That’s, that’s really the goal for what we want to do.

31:44 – That’s so amazing. I just have to pause and call out how amazing those two feature sets are together. I had the opportunity of seeing kind of a walkthrough of this a few weeks ago at the converted conference and we’ll have to post a link to your blog where you kind of goes into more depth into how all of that is working because it’s just a phenomenal set of tools and I can go on and on and also you know when you’re talking about being an entrepreneur and we’re talking about the future and anything we’re going to do in our businesses in order to really see if we can take advantage of some of these tools is we’re gonna have to test and I can’t test by calling up my facebook ads professional and saying, Hey, I’d like to think of putting together this campaign thing. What do you think? And two weeks later she gets back to me with an actual campaign that’s not a test.

32:40 – So if I’m going to actually test a new product or an or a new feature of my own, this is perfect to start. And then I can say, wow, this is working, yes, I want to invest in this and then go to that person to get deeper.

32:56 – That’s right. It’s incredible. And one of the cool things, Mary Kathryn about that with what we’re doing at lead pages specifically is because we have this built in partnership and this ad builder from within lead pages and the Pixel is being tracked and the connections being made at the right levels. We’re able to connect leads and the checkout sales back to the ad so we’re able to show in this new feature an Roi on your ad campaign, which is usually kind of elusive, right? When you’re doing ad campaigns with different tools, you have to look at dashboards that may or may not be sinked up and that’s something that we’re really excited about too, is the analytic side and tracking the actual revenue from this whole setup.

33:39 – Yeah, you can even get down to tracking a lifetime value of a customer in drip and that that just blows my mind that you can do that all in one tool and it’s connected to everywhere else that we’re marketing online. And you have shopping carts and lead pages and you can track purchases and I mean it’s basically you’ve come full circle. You can, you can follow the customer all everywhere and make sure that you’re accessing everything you need and they, they’re accessing everything you need. Yeah. So wow. So the future is here.

34:15 – Yeah. And actually I’d love to add a point to that. Mary Kathryn, you mentioned the checkouts having a shopping card. So we, we, a few months ago released checkouts which allows people to use stripe with their landing pages. And what’s really cool though, and this is part of what the future of marketing is, we’re not requiring you to use that. You can still connect lead pages to paypal or to shopify or to these other tools and if you choose to use stripe and checkouts, great, you’re going to have a more streamlined experience. But we’re never trying to be an all in one system. And I think that’s really important to know. The future of marketing is not all in one. There are too many tools that are really good at a small sliver and what we believe is to is to be true for drip and lead pages. Future is that the API connections, the neurons that go between these tools is what’s really important.

35:07 – And so if you’re in that camp where you want the all-in-one, you know more power to you. There are some things out there that try to be that, but just like those you know, phone, fax, copy, machine behemoth that are in your office to have the three things usually break and you’re stuck with a really expensive paperweight that might do one of the things you thought. And if it does do all three, it doesn’t do all three well. So we’re really keen and big on the idea of being really good at what we do and being able to provide as much of the solution possible. But knowing that there’s always going to be some tool that we want to connect to, that our end users are going to want to connect to, to make their marketing really sing.

35:47 – So that’s another important part about the future that you’re able to do with us, and that we believe very strongly in, and that is, I feel like I’m just kind of a commercial here for the number one thing that I love about the software. And, I think that get key is so important because I constantly have clients coming to me saying, well, what about this tool that I’ve found that it’s for chiropractors and it does email and it does your crm and it does all this in one and it’s just really hard to try and project people in the future and say, well, you’re gonna come across a limitation at some point with an all in one solution and you’re really kind of locking yourself into something that you’re going to be stuck with. And, and so that’s what I really love, that you can connect to so many different things with drip and in a much more integrated way than just like Zapier or Zapier does, um, connections, but it doesn’t bring the data with it the way drip does. And that’s what I love about that.

36:56 – Wow. Wow. Wow. So where do you think this is all going? So we’ve talked about Apis, we’ve talked about new solutions that you might build in. We’ve talked about being able to follow people. Is there something that you can share? Obviously I don’t want you to, you, you’re not gonna be able to share anything proprietary, but is there something that you see just in general on the horizon for marketing and is there, is there some type of connection that is a, that we can make to really take advantage of the future? Do you have a specific type of tool or a tip that our audience can use as kind of their futurist advantage?

37:42 – Yeah. Well, I mean not to sound too obvious a homer, but I think drip is one of those powerful tools that a lot of people are going to underestimate the power of a, what it can do right now, let alone what it’s going to be able to do in the future. So the biggest thing for the future that is now is personalization. And personalization requires a bit of tracking. Now everybody loves to talk about facebook as an advertising platform because facebook knows everything there is to know about a person because of their behavior on that platform. The reality is is that with the drip js, the drip javascript snippet that you can put on your website, we don’t know all the stuff that’s going on around the web that you might be doing that facebook might be connected to, but within your emails and all the pages that you put the drip code on, you can track their behavior, their time, you know, have different pages that they’re on and so forth, and then be able to showcase different content based on what people have shown you in the past.

38:40 – So right now if you wanted to do so, it’s a little bit more advanced. It is something that has some. Something like somebody like Brennan Dunn is doing really well. One of our original core users and that is to be able to to show content on a page based on the drip javascript. Going back to the drip database and seeing we know this person, we’ve seen them before. They have this tag and this custom field, so show them this thing and if they have something different or we don’t know them, show this, this other thing. So you’re able to do that right now with drip and as people understand the power of that, they’re going to be utilizing it a lot more going forward and I think there’s going to be more tools like that, that are able to show people different content on the page, not just based on where they came from, but about the information that’s been gathered about them along the way and the rest of the marketing that you’ve been doing and to do so in such a way that doesn’t feel overly creepy or overly stockish.

39:38 – That’s the real danger I think, of things like this system is put people off. But when you’re talking about having a trigger link, and I’m going to get a little geeky on you for just a second, which obviously you could handle it because that’s what you love to do. But take for example, the idea of having a welcome message after lead magnet that they sign up for on a certain lead page, for example. And the welcome email says, cool, here’s the. Here’s the report you asked for. Which of these three things do you find the number one problem for your business or for your relationships, for your finances are for your health or whatever your business is about. They click one of those three links and it sends a message to drip that that guy clicked on, which drip then says, cool, put the custom field with this value.

40:22 – Okay, and then because of workflows, you can then add the person who has problem a to a problem, a facebook audience, and now you start running ads to them about problem. A two solutions have landing pages about problem a, but if they clicked on b, they never see those ads because they’re in a different workflow. They’re going to go see the b set of marketing tools. When they go to another landing page, they’re going to see that be set up and when they go to your pricing page, they’re going to see by this thing because we solve problem b, but if they have a or see as their main choice, they would see different things entirely. So being able to personalize based on their behavior or their activity within your marketing that’s going to be where people get a lot of power and you can do that now with drip and you don’t have to wait for the future to happen in the future is more people or know how to do it and they’re going to have an easier time to do it and we’re going to be able as a company to have more blueprints and more examples to showcase for people where they don’t have to, you know, go in right now.

41:26 – They have to go in and code it themselves and that’s awesome for the people who know how to do that, but we know that we need to templatize that more and be able to hand people. Okay. If you want to track these sorts of things, here’s the kind of stuff that you want to put into your to your code, so that’s where we’re headed, but we’re already there. It’s just a function of making it simpler and more approachable for people who aren’t, you know, gearheads techies like us.

41:49 – Oh my gosh, I have a feeling they’re going to be some people in the audience watching you that are going to be signing up for a your certification program pretty quickly. With that in mind, I mean, that’s. That’s incredible. It really, I mean, I can imagine in the future, static webpages that just give basic information and we thought were so wonderful in marketing and give all he hit, all the hot buttons are going to be gone because we’re going to deliver content to people when they need it, where they need it and exactly what they need.

42:22 – Wow. Yep. That’s right. That’s right. Message at the right time, the right person. That’s the. That’s the goal with any marketing automation, marketing automation or marketing in general. Again, it’s, and it’s very important not to think that this is replacing human interaction and relationship. It’s simply allowing people to get a solution faster and for those human interactions to be a little more tailored towards the right kinds of conversations. Right. Yeah.

42:51 – So do you, and I think we’re both, our minds are just kind of like taking it all in. Do you have any final tips or tools or anything that, that will give people the futurist advantage you’ve, you’ve given us so much so far, but anything else that you wanted to fit in?

43:16 – Oh, did we lose? Nope, there I am. Sorry about that. I had it on mute. We have a, I’m doing this obviously from my Home Office and the little one dog barking in the little one down the down the stairs here a little bit. Um, but nevertheless, obviously, you know, picking up dripping lead pages as a software tool would be great and we’ve got links for that to share here in a second. But also it’s about continuing to learn. You know, I, I don’t want you to feel like you don’t know enough to take action on things, but I also want you and everybody else, you watching, anybody you’re talking to you, I want you to carve out some time every week, every month especially to learn what is the next thing or more importantly, what’s the thing you want to be focused on and what’s a new implementation or new adaptation of that tool.

44:11 – So pay attention to the right podcast, pay attention to the right youtube channels and just keep continuing to be informed. But don’t let the glut of information hold you back from taking action. You know, this is a double edge sword with all this content, this, even this summit, you know, there’s so many great people that are sharing what’s the next thing and if there’s real danger in that, in that you’re going to come away with a bunch of ideas that you’re gonna want to implement, but you cannot, cannot put them all into action at the same time. So get out a pen and paper, you know, old school technology. Use a mind mapping tool if you want, like I love to do and jot down the things you want to accomplish and make sure you’re prioritizing them so that the top one, two or three things get done right away and then the other things it sounds really cool, you can put on the back burner for a little bit and get to them when it’s more appropriate for your business, but trying to build, you know, eight, 10, 12 things at the same time.

45:12 – He is not going to get anything done. So pick one or two of the things that you’ve been listening to from Kelly and Mary, Kathryn and me and the other guests to pick and hopefully you know, for my sake, I love for you to be using drip adly pages to do that, but whatever it is, I’m just stick to the one or two things and then when time allows, incorporate some of the other cool things along the way.

45:35 – That is so perfect. Thank you so much. That’s wonderful advice. Great way to wrap things up for those watching and we will have links to both lead pages and drip below so you can sign up and see how wonderful these tools are. Any parting words? Mary Kathryn? Oh my gosh. You just used, you were preaching to the choir right there. I am. So, yes. To be able to access the things that you really need right now. I mean we just again came full circle. We started our conversation talking about that and you just perfectly transitioned to, to bringing, bringing us right back there. And I, I have so loved chatting with you, Bob. I really can’t wait to stay connected and stay in your world. I’m already there, but in the future and, and just see what’s coming. It’s gonna be so amazing. Thank you for spending this time with us.

46:31 – You’re very welcome. And thank you for having me. Thank you for putting this together and have them in such great guests. I’ve been loving everybody that what they’re sharing as well. And you know, I want to make sure that we know who’s coming to lead pages and drip thanks to this conversation so their links are included in the conversation, but if you’re just listening to the sun and audio or, those are where you are going to want to go so we can make sure that we can recognize that you’re coming from this conversation. And in the last parting words I would say is to take action and revise later. You know, take one of the things that you’re learning from this session or any of the other sessions and don’t wait to feel like you have it 100 percent perfect to move forward with it.

47:18 – Instead, take action on it. Listen to the feedback loop you get from your new customers or your new subscribers. You’re the content that you’re putting out the feedback you get and then revise as you go. Think the biggest problem most business owners and entrepreneurs have is that they revised before they start. You know, they keep thinking and thinking and overthinking a in perfecting the plan a when the best way to move forward in your business is to show the world what you think is the best thing. Revise it as you go and continue to improve because of that. So, that’s my final shot for you. Thank you.