The Marketing Futurist Podcast

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This is your futurist advantage!

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With your hosts:

Mary Kathryn Johnson & Kelly Garrett

Ep009: It’s Time to ReImagine Your Definition of Scale When Using Chatbots According to Andrew Yarashevsky, COO of Chatfuel

Show Transcript:

00:00 – And you know, myself, you know Kelly and the person on the screen, I can’t wait to introduce you to if you don’t know him already. Andrew Yarashevsky of chatfuel. He’s the coo and c p o at chatfuel. Hey Andrew, how you doing?

00:15 – Good. What about you?

00:16 – I’m, I’m loving life. Let me tell ya. We’re just rolling. We’re just this rocket ship. I’m telling you right now. It’s amazing to hear all these, these people, you guys are just doing incredible things so I can’t wait to jump in and, and find out more about it. So where we want to start is just kind of introduce you, I gave you a basic introduction but you tell us a little bit more about who you are, what you do and of course your company just as an introduction. Alright, sure. So yeah.

00:49 – And I’ve been in tech for like 15 years and I started as a software engineer. I’m originally from Ukraine, so program my, my English and I lived in Ukraine most of my life I guess. I live in work in Denmark, in Copenhagen. Then I moved to Moscow. Russia, I worked at a, at a rush on tech giant Yandex, which is like Russian and Google and Amazon and spotify and whatever, and Uber and I spend there like six years or five years and then moved here to San Francisco Bay area and I’m together with my partners within the chat, the palladium platform to create chatbots for nontechnical people. I cannot myself, I cannot call myself necessarily. I, I’m, I mostly from the, from the engineering and all that part, but I didn’t see that when you come by and things like engineering and technology is with something that is a, not necessarily related to that.

02:02 – It might be by the tag and might be a medication, might be marketing. This is where you get to the new level where you get the disruptions. So I think, yeah, it’s, it’s a, it’s a good combination. Chatfuel, I just wanted to give it a little bit of background. We power more than 90,000 bots right now. And these are, they like monthly active, monthly active bots are just like, you know, bad, bad bots or something. These are real, that, that served two more than 90 million people worldwide. So it’s like, yeah, it’s a huge audience to learn from. We really enjoy that because there are lots of use cases. Let’s have a different black creators and marketers around the world. And and we have, you know, we have, we, we manage, we still don’t understand how, but we managed to build a tool that it is both by like big brands that are really like crazy on like flexibility, integration, stuff like that, like team all bile or burglary or a Dieta us and likewise. And we also have a lot of smb is maybe like majority and like restaurants, like coffee shops and uh, things of that nature. So, yeah, we are, we’re like a little spa started up like, we have around 20, 20 teammates, two officers. Why in Moscow, Russia, one in San Francisco. And we have some, some decent, uh, investors and advisors. So that’s, that’s a little bit about us.

03:47 – Yeah. And of course, Kelly and I are immersed in the world of Bots, definitely all day everyday. And I love what you said. I love, absolutely love the word disrupt. Yes, just do, you know, it’s, it’s uh, it’s not as violent of a word is. It could be, but it’s, we are absolutely participating in that disruption. So, tell me a little bit more about why you think this is disruptive. Why do you think so? How, how are bots? I love the way you tied in the engineering and the technology with the application, with education, marketing, all those kinds of things. So how does that technology disrupt things when it gets combined with other industries?

04:34 – Oh yeah. I mean, you know, we in like more broadly, not just on the marketing right now, right. Did I get it right? So, I mean if, they do probably, an example that would everybody understand is more like Madison, right? There is like a lot of, you know, observations and experiments being made and a lot of patients going on with the same, same Tom’s. Right. But there is no, never been a combined database of Kinda seem Thompson and outcomes, right? And then nobody til this, this stage try to actually put a machine into that and do the machine learning that will actually try to find the correlation between the symptoms and outcomes. This is like a completely new level of that, right? It’s not just the brain off a couple of experts. They will try to find the answer. It’s actually the machine, the same machine that serves to Google results to you is like, it’s capable of a huge calculations.

05:41 – And I think these things could find some, some correlations, maybe conversations for, for the diseases and you know, and curious. And another thing is a like basically people being working with more like a gen sets and rules. Like if you have a headache then you probably have these. But there was no system in place that could be doing this in the personalized way. So every, every single person is a unique being. And if we can understand the genome, for example, then you could basically have a specific appeal to your needs. Right? And these are going to be like a completely new level of disruption if you take the same examples to the marketing, I think this is, this is basically all oldest, all the same, approaches that could be taken like a bird, like I’m gonna be seeing pretty trivial things, but marketing will become personalized for sure. More and more tools and platforms will know more about people and, and mark, they’ll will know how to use that. And instead of like bombarding people with, with all the offers and everything, you’re, every single person will be getting exactly the thing they need at exactly the time and that, that, that is, that is, that comes only with a, with a big data and the ability for platforms to process it, predict and then recommend, do recommendation and things like that.

07:18 – I love that because you know, you think about, going back to the medical example, clinical trials, and even in marketing, we look at statistics and statistics account for a majority of the population. And that’s what you make your decisions on is what whatever is the most popular or whatever is the most frequently occurring thing. But with yeah, like you say with, you know, having the database and the computer ability to analyze that data. We’re, we’re talking about individuals and we can make decisions and personalization for somebody on an individual level person who was in the minority, which up until now we’ve been able. We haven’t been able to do that. That’s, that’s fascinating. I love it. Absolutely.

08:03 – When we look on the cloud from the users, like of course there is again, like if we take the, the, the general said there is like, you know, peak hours where people open up their notification, some bonds, right? And you could probably like tailored to this peak hours and you will be in good shape. But in order to be in the best shape, you actually need to understand when everyone is on the messenger so you don’t disrupt their flow. And like do this exact exactly the time when needed. And this is where were you do instead of like one to many. You do one on one.

08:37 – So we’re talking about everything we’ve been doing in social media and technology has been really to broaden and to reach as many people as possible and group people into certain groups so that we can send information to them based on their group they belong to where our social media reach. But really what we’re doing is we’ve gone broad like that and now it sounds like what you’re saying is our disruption is that we can now take that data, that broad data and pinpoint it down to the individual level and that is a a complete disruption in the way our. The way we’ve been thinking of the word scale, right? I mean we think of sale absolutely huge and reaching everybody, but really the only way you can really scale effectively in the future it sounds like is to get to the individual.

09:30 – Absolutely. Yeah. You firstly need to drill it down and then like you, you, you kind of need to reimagine that. Again, you need to drill it down to very personal needs and then, and right now you’re late by opening an Abi, the Messenger and other personal channels. You actually have this ability and then you need to think of, alright, how do you scale to other people like they use and how do you do the said that technology to, to do like one by one.

09:58 – Wow. Wow. Okay. So thinking about that. Go ahead. Go ahead Kelly. Oh well no. So I was just gonna say that. So my, the biggest, I’m hesitant and reluctant that I get when it comes to using messenger is it’s way too personal. So, you know, we’re, we’re talking about that personalization as a good thing. Well, what are the potential pitfalls of that and how do you help people that feel like it’s too personal and they don’t want to go down that road?

10:27 – Oh yeah. I mean, this is, this is a tricky thing. I think like the beautiful uphold these personalization is that, I mean it might become scary. Sure. And a lot of it, a lot of tools, a lot of market areas that have those tools in their hands will not, will know a lot about you. Right. And I think it’s like, it’s still a big question. It’s not only marketing, it’s kind of gonna be like everywhere. And I, I don’t have really an answer to this question because like, even if you read, there was a book from Eric Schmidt who, whether they see your google for many years, he wrote a book like a, I dunno, like three, five years ago about the future. Very interesting. And when you like, you know, when I, when I was opening optives bouquet, I expected him to talk about robots and things like that.

11:23 – Like, I dunno know, a plane, chairs, whatever. How long the book was about, like the privacy and how this whole thing will just go crazy. Absolutely. Howard will does rob, like even like governments and countries and political ecosystem and everything. And it was like, I was like, all right, all right, right. Where is the flying sharing? And there’s still like how the Brooklyn leg. All right guys, here’s what’s going to happen, here’s what’s going to happen. And we don’t really have a solution to that. So this is just a thing, a thing to, to be always aware of. And why don’t. One of the things we’re trying to do is, at some point we understand like when we were looking at the marketers that use our platform, right? We, we found there like different types of them and some of them just really don’t really respect their audience and they just, you know, use them like, all right, we’ve got this people, we arbitrage traffic, we, you know, like move them to their offers, whatever, I don’t care what’s going to happen next.

12:34 – Right? And we understand like this is not the way to go. I mean this is not how we wanted to see the future. And and we, you starting to focus more on people who try to build a longterm relationships and, and, and, and, and the respect of their audience. And we found that people who actually do that and have this mindset, they, by nature, they don’t exploit the data that they received from the, from the users and users actually feel that and they are not hesitant to, to give more information to receive more personalized offers and the right time and and basically build a better connection with this, with this brand or business. So, I mean it goes both ways, right? So when, when you ask people about like with brands, what do you recommend? The answer is something. And then when you drill down on why, this is one of the reasons is like, all right, I trust them, I can give, like I can give them my everything, like all my information, where would been my ssn wherever, because like I know they will not exploited it.

13:40 – And what are we try to do as a bill for and where we let people do that. And, and, and understand the importance of, of building the relationships we’re going to be. I didn’t know predicting, like block rates. So if you, for example, did that. Here’s how many people are going to block you for that. Be Aware. Right. And like trying to say all the time with every staff remind that hey we’re, we are not a tool for the, for the short term. Right? Right. Use a CPU if you really want to build a longterm relationship.

14:14 – Wow. So you’re like helping predict when people are going to do something that’s going to make people distrust them. Well we have some.

14:26 – So as, as experiments right now it’s not production ready but we, we do believe that that’s going to be the theater because like we, we are one of the tools that have the ability to do that. Not many of them can do that. And I’m like we feel the responsibility to that if we’d like, we need to do that in order to, to make their whole experience cleaner. Right? So if people, if people get the like a prediction that hey, I’m going to just like send it like should it these 200,000 people and it will receive like 20 percent low grade instead. I can send it to 20,000 people, but it’s going to be like, exactly on point and uh, you know, he can choose right instead of like sending and then figuring it out. Right.

15:14 – Wow. So I’m, I’m super fascinating to me because I feel like humans, you know, the human flaw is that we all want to have everybody’s trust. We all want people to trust us, but we’re somehow inherently bad at knowing what it is that we will do that will cause someone to distrust us. So that, that’s amazing. I love that.

15:35 – Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. Yeah. We need to, we do understand that it’s not for, for someone. So for some cases, if not necessarily comes from the bad intention, right? Like a result of not knowing how to do that. Right. And, and like we, we again feel a responsibility. We need to bring this knowledge for sure.

15:57 – Hmm. Wow. Same thing, like you were talking about with medicine or anything else, the application of this is going to allow us by you gathering that data and you can tell us. Okay. I mean, I can imagine it’s going to be a little pop up that’ll say, okay, based on our experience, this is what’s going to happen if you push go and when that happens we can make that decision. Oh, I don’t care, I just want to send it, or oh, that doesn’t sound good so that you’re giving us that information. And the people who say, I don’t care, I’m just going to send it. Well, they’re going to kind of a disrupted themselves and get themselves out of the system automatically by on their own. They’ll get less engagement, they’ll have less followers and they’ll, they’ll weed themselves out. So we don’t have to be the police, so to speak.

16:48 – Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. And the more it goes, the more the more thing is going to be connected to that. So for example, right now it might be like, all right, you’re going to send this and you will see much law grades, but then we could also like, I don’t know, check for what people say about you on twitter off to that or whether they wrote to customer support were they angry or not and things like that. And it’s just a lot of. So again, if you think of every individual is a, every user is an individual with some context and some other places they can be like twitter, facebook, any social media like go into customer support on your website and then trying to find a word to call you to yell at you or whatever. Then you’re going to combine all this thing and, and, and, and said these lake and attributes of the user that you can then check and the system can actually check, find the correlations and predict this next time. So yeah, this is what I call the real personalization on that.

17:50 – I am it. Yeah. That’s amazing. So, so thinking about that in the future though, because if that’s where we’re headed and it’s, that to me is a, is a beautiful place we’re headed, it’s not as scary as some of the things that we’ve been talking about. So, you know, so that’s, that’s wonderful. But what might be some of the pitfalls for that? So what, what are some of the obstacles that we might face to get us to that point that you see?

18:17 – Yeah, I think like, yeah, I believe that they’re still gonna be people that, well we’ll think more like a short term and we’ll try to explore the new, like exploited the new abilities that comes out. It comes with that, right? So, and I mean they, this happens like everywhere there. I mean any new channel opens up like they’re going to be people that are trying to get as much as possible right now and don’t care what implication that’s going to be and and, and the portfolio that people might like, it might get just a, the whole channel or their whole tool kinda not trusted anymore for the people. So for example, leaving the mosque is a messenger gonna be overflowed with some spammy offers or whatever, and then other people will not trust team, although that is going to be writing to that right or something.

19:19 – So, and this is, this is a beautiful. And we were working closely working with facebook team on that because like, there, there are some, some, some abilities to disrupt these, these acquisition channel even more, but the only reason we don’t do this is we need to figure out what’s going to happen if somebody is going to explore this in a wrong way. So, so yeah, we, we still trying to think about on how to do this properly, but there are much more common there will make it much easier to toggle between businesses and users and in market to them. Right.

20:02 – So what lessons have you learned through this whole process of, of chatfuel being one of the companies, one of the major companies communicating in, in this platform and allowing people to communicate in this platform. What lessons have you learned that have helped you develop and help develop chatfuel? To what it is and what it will become.

20:26 – Oh, well there, there, there, there is a log in a way where every day we’re learning something new. I mean I, I probably cannot like call only well what we, what are we really liked was the approach we took initially and I think we all that this is, this is a correct way to go with. So we instead of like trying to guess what people would want from the front of the, from until like chatfuel and then try to design it initially for that we of open up where early and did it like in a very broad way. So here it’ll kick into the building blocks that you have. You can create content, combined them together and here is your body. We really didn’t know like whether it’s going to be like for customer support or marketing or media or whatever. We just put it out there like media immediately spotted on like we got all these like tech crunch article sports and everything like that.

21:27 – And then people started flowing in and, and we, we careful to look at what people were doing and talk to everybody and then we started figuring out, all right, I want an interesting, that’s an interesting concept. Like we can, we can really scale that or here is a people that take the email sequences that they’ve been like nurturing for years and, or maybe decades, right? And then putting in the messenger and immediately get like five. I’m more efficient. Right. Bigger efficiency. So, and like what else do they need? And then we started to cost them more. So it’s Kinda like getting there early, experimenting, getting feedback and Ali after that, trying to, to, you know, tailor this to your specific needs. I think that was a, that was a good approach. Maybe you’d be a lesson. Um, and I, and another thing is I think it’s really important to be coherent with, with, with with what do you do it right?

22:31 – So it’s like, again, like there, there are different types of people that use bonds for different things. And we realized that we really want to focus only on the ones who make the bots like we want to see as a future. So, and that, that made it much, much easier because like there were a lot of people that come in and they want to be us and they do whatever they want. But really when you stick to, to, to this, to the concept or to, to do the impact you want to make then is just, it just becomes much easier, you know? Yeah. And, that’s, that’s an important lesson a week. Yeah.

23:15 – So the money’s not really important there because it doesn’t align with where you want to go. So it’s very easy to turn that down.

23:23 – Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. I mean it’s like it’s never been a money for us and it’s like we are a, like, you can’t, you can sign up at chatfuel for free and created your bot without any limitations. And we were more, more like, you know, about like making a, of getting scale. And of course, if you can just focus on everyone and let everyone do whatever they want, you’re going to get bigger. But if you really stick to your beliefs, then you just, you know, do like, do they improvement in the product and market product only to the wise that you think are right? What I mean, we are here for a long term, right? Again, like if we screw it up, then there is not going to be chatfield so.

24:13 – Right? All the marketers in the audience listen up for just a quick buck stick together, stick to your moral, stick to your ethics, stick to where you want to go in life. And you’ll be fine. You’ll be able to get there.

24:29 – Absolutely. Absolutely. Yeah.

24:33 – They’re there, they’re there. You just need to invest in this a bit more. I mean, it’s like you the, the Messenger Channel, we’re working in it. It just gives you a unique really unique abilities to get to know more, information about your, your audience, people who really love answering questions in the chat. This is what the native we do like every day and they, they really like, we, we’ve been surprised like why the one of the lessons and learning suite God when we launched with that anyway, people really like talking to, to bots and given them like all the secrets and everything like easily and, and, and like again, it’s a security, but at the same time if you, if you do it the right way, you can have a list of subscribers and you can have, you know, they are February light like music really well when they get it up a with the families and what their habits are and likes and everything like that. And these gives you an ability to like them thing and segment people and, and, and, and, you know, communicate with them. When did you do differently? So you just, yeah, you just need to think of like, what do you want to know in order to provide a better service? Design it this way and it’s really easy right now. And then, and then, use that. So.

26:00 – Wow. So what, I know we’re all in the same industry right now and you are actually creating the reality that Kelly and I and the people in the audience get to play around in, what drives you nuts about this? What really bugs you about this industry? Let’s get real.

26:23 – Yeah. I mean this is this is a tricky question. Well yeah, we talk a lot about like what, what could it goes bad behavior. But I, I generally think that it’s like, not, not everybody is that conscious, just think about this. But we tend to see it like in an observed that marketing in general is, is, is very intrusive and, and I think the more we, the more like if you look at the past 10 years, the attention span of people has, has changed a lot, right? And and, and a lot of chat, like you get much more channels of information than it was before. Like before you could get a newspaper, like a TV. And the dad was pretty much it. Right now you have all the internet and it pops out from every year from facebook, email messenger and everything and it’s like, and I think it, it always like, it tries to get your attention and it competes with other signals and it’s never, it looks like a never ending game when you’re like, all right, to get more attention, I need to use warrants acts that that gets your dump on me and things like that, you know?

27:48 – And it’s like, and when you just as step back and look at that, just saying like oh my gosh, like this, these people really intrusive and frantic, exploited me and instead I would just. And every time like they, they get in my intention, they actually like break me out of the flow from something. They’re always doing it. And I think like the, the oral impact of that, like not a lot of people try to estimate, but like getting millions of people out of the flow actually like reduces what their whole humanity can do in this time. Right? So we just like, we could progress much faster if we just let people do what they good at. Right. So yeah, that’s like, this is really like something that, something that fundamentally that we will need to solve. Right. And even like if you look at facebook, this is a, again, a thing like, like they, they have a good social impact, but at the same time if we look at that, people just stick to this new speed, not necessarily something where a, something that, that makes them better. So it’s like, you know, so yeah, I think, I think this is like a really big thing that’s something that really drive us nuts that we like, but this is something really fundamental that we were thinking of that needs to be solved.

29:13 – Wow. Yeah. And it’s so good to hear you say that you’re thinking about it and trying to contribute to the solution because I think it’s easy for so many of us to look at that problem and just get depressed by it and say, oh, the world is going downhill, or whatever. Somebody else will figure it out. Right? Exactly. Exactly. Or just complain about them. Yeah,

29:37 – So at some point like I like, yeah, I realized that. Who else if not, if not a grade and then I, I mean the word will be much better if like everybody on this way. Right?

29:57 – So everybody in the audience, that’s what we’re doing, right it send this to people, give it so that they. So that we all start, even though we’re marketers and we have to sell a product or we have to do a customer service or whatever it is we have to do, we don’t have to just try and get more attention and be louder just to disrupt everybody’s Day. You’re right. I agree 100 percent. And that brings us back to the beginning of our conversation when we can get much more individualistic and think about the times that. So if I get on facebook at a certain time, that’s my choice and if the Bot knows that I’m there at that time and I’ll probably be there again tomorrow or the next day or in a month, then that’s my choice to be there. It doesn’t mean you have to push your Bot at me five times a day when I’m not there. And. And people. You can also turn off your notifications anytime, right? Yeah. And then you won’t get it at all.

30:57 – Yeah, I mean, but then then, then it’s a bit harder to distinguish a like when you turn it off completely, like some really important at once. Right? So sound something that I didn’t really want to meet.

31:14 – I believe my. There’s going to be businesses that are going to be texting you. They already did. Yeah. In, in, in like a much more a new way than you used to have these text and for you you probably know that the apple is all working on opening up the platform in the message where businesses could communicate. So that will give a completely new level of what’s possible. So I mean there’s not going to be things like a, this is like only for personnel and this is for businesses across together and might necessarily might not necessarily be bad if we, again, think about that responsible, right?

32:00 – Yes, I agree with you and I’m so thankful that you are there and you are believing in that future because as long as people like you are creating companies on those platforms to allow us to have businesses there, then we’re good. Or hopefully we will be able to use our, our attention and our dollars to get rid of the companies who aren’t like you to make room for the companies who are. So yeah, I, I believe in that future. I believe in it.

32:28 – Yeah. I also, I also believe like again, the good, the better competition in this space in terms of like marketers that do they experience, the, the, the better we get. So it’s more like at some point there’s going to be like a quick buck, right? But then at some point people realize like, all right, I mean if I do this then I will, I’ll compare these marketers in a long run and what we really do is like, instead of like given this, this channel, like for example Messenger Channel to people who know how to Code A, we are actually given this channel to a lot more people like hundred x more or even more that are nontechnical and this is the beauty of that because like then you can get more people, more people. They’re trying to compete in terms of use better user experience and benefit eventually get to the right point.

33:24 – Foster, right. So it was just very inspiring because it’s skin on, we just going to get there to the right point faster. But it also like I remember when I was like 13 and I was, I was starting my career is as a software engineer. I was, I was thinking like why do you like this? Right. And when I wrote my first like couple of programs, I realized, I mean I, I just get this in amazing emotion when I went to understand that it can control machine, I ride so something and it just reacts exactly how I teach them to do so it was like this isn’t worried, good feeling that any power something and believe me or not, we receive daily emails from nontechnical people, from non technical marketers and say like, Hey, I never in my life builds something. Any APP that is actually behaving as a designer like right now with chatfuel I can do that. And a, you’re absolutely a hundred percent in this standard or feeling because like I’ve been there. Right? So it’s really a very motivational for us to do something that everybody can use and experience this feeling of building, building a machine rules or APP or whatever you call it.

34:46 – There is nothing that compares to that feeling. I’m a web developer and I know exactly what you mean. And it’s. Yeah. Yeah. And I’m not saying I know exactly what you mean. Yeah. And I never really thought of it that way. I keep, I keep explaining, I keep describing myself as a wannabe geek, a want to be techie because I love playing with this stuff, but I’ve never gotten deep enough to be a developer like you guys are. You have given me the ability to do that and that’s exactly how I feel. It is so incredible to be able to have. Yeah. Yeah. Wow. Wow. Okay. So where do you, we always look for some type of a tool or a tip because this is really looking at the future of marketing and obviously the future of tech in many, many ways in business. So do you have a tool or a tip that you can suggest to our audience that will give them that futurist advantage that will help them take advantage of what’s coming in the future but apply it today?

35:53 – Of course you guys, you guys need to just start with, with go into chatfuel and then creating your first bot is, as you can see people just, you don’t, you don’t need to have any, any skills for that necessarily. So just, go ahead and try and, and this is going to be your one more step to a exploding you channels and, and experimenting. I think in order to just be in a good position in the future, you just need to be like we’re really moving fast and try and do things right. And that’s, that’s for sure. The one thing to try and win once you were there or anywhere else I think you, you, you really like the most important, cheap again is like try to start asking your, your, your people instead of like pushing them, just firstly ask and understand them better like where they are and that was it.

36:53 – The problem is they have and why. And then it could be really like if you’re in the past you needed to just take a phone and call and talk to everybody individually. It, you understand that right now you can really have this one and a lot of conversation at scale and as well give your day information like where we really fast. And we, we, for example, our resell use use this technique. So for example, when I as a, as a, as a product manager I need, she understands something and I need to talk to people. Sometimes we just designed a quick survey in a bod and send this to people that will know that we know they’re going to be relevant to this and we really like this is the fastest way to get the really meaningful like response. We’d get like in 20 minutes I get all I need instead of like, you wouldn’t if you do this and service in the email or something, people don’t reply to this. It’s going to take days and everything here is like just pressing some squeak of West. So yeah, it just. You asked me something. Yeah, I need that. Just a little bit of free, free, free, free.

38:00 – Love sharing that information in Messenger. And I can’t tell you how many times I’ve told someone, someone is asking me why should I have a Bot? And that’s my answer is that the amount of personal information they’ll give you an insight that they’ll give you is just not comparable. There’s nothing out there right now that you can have that.

38:18 – Yeah, absolutely. And, and just, then once together and read this response is just don’t stop there. And, and, and started to find the commonalities of this people and segment them and then understand like better like, all right, who they are and what are the attributes of these group and how can I market to them better and we’re going to be supporting you along the way. We’re going to be, again, the older tools for the segmentation and better, better marketing to people and understanding more and more. So I think, yeah, in combination with, with really a responsibility for our user’s attention and, and building a longterm relationship with your audience, you’re definitely going to be in good shape in the future.

39:06 – I love that. Thank you. Andrew. Thank you so much. I just, I love chatting with you. I’m so honored that you shared your time with us and, and shared where you’re going. I know chatfuel is coming out with some crazy stuff. You’ve just added parts to your platform. Being able to search and know exactly the people that are in your, in your body and in your platform, which is invaluable information, um, to, to do exactly what you’re talking about. These personalization. So thank you so much. Is there, is there any last thoughts that you’d like to give the people in the audience or you know, just say, have a great afternoon. See you later.

39:45 – No, I mean I, I really enjoyed the conversation. I like a like would you guys do an. And I think yeah, it’s important to you. Why did people on what, what might be coming in the future? I mean the last quick tip is to the audience is like guys stick to stick to, to, to these guys and I know that Mary does an amazing job in bots. Really? Like we, I, I really think if you just gonna be listening, what Mary recommends, you’re going to be good. So yeah. My goodness. Thank you. So that’s to eat. Have you? So yeah. Thank you guys and have a wonderful afternoon.